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April 10, 2008 2:30 PM PDT

Nvidia CEO goes on Intel rant

Nvidia CEO and co-founder Jen-Hsun Huang let rip with a diatribe against Intel at Nvidia's financial analyst day on Thursday. Huang cited frustration with recent Intel comments stating that discrete graphics cards will become "unnecessary."

Nvidia CEO Jen-Hsun Huang

Nvidia CEO Jen-Hsun Huang

(Credit: Nvidia)

Because Intel, the world's largest chipmaker, includes integrated-graphics silicon in most of its chipsets the company has become the world's largest supplier of graphics chips. Its upcoming Nehalem processors will move the graphics from the chipset onto the same piece of silicon as the main processor. A design that is expected to result in vastly better performance.

(Note: A contrarian take on the graphics market states that Nvidia remains the #1 graphics supplier because approximately 73 million Intel integrated graphics processors (IGP) are unused in systems due to "double-attach" with an Nvidia solution, according to Doug Freedman of American Technology Research. More here at ExtremeTech.)

This image of Intel as an unstoppable graphics juggernaut is what Huang takes issue with. What set him off initially was a comment from an Intel graphics and gaming technologist who said that consumers "probably won't need" discrete cards in the future. Nvidia's primary business is designing and supplying graphics chips for discrete graphics cards that go into PCs.

"We don't typically like to do this. It's just that we've been taking it and taking it and taking it. Every single frickin' day. Are you allowed to say that word? Every day all over the world. Enough is enough."

Huang was especially upset about Intel's claims of boosting integrated graphics performance in the future, saying Intel's claims paled against what Nvidia will achieve by that time.

"Claim after claim after claim. They're just false. They cross the line of fair play," he said. "Here's another one. Nvidia's gonna be dead. Because we're (Intel) sticking the graphics in the CPU and (Nvidia) will have no place to stick it," he said.

Huang also attacked Intel's marketing machine. "Just because they have this enormous marketing budget. Just because they have platforms everywhere in the world. It doesn't make it right. To take on smaller companies. It's just not right."

Huang also mounted an aggressive defense of gaming on the PC--one of the main reasons many consumers opt for Nvidia graphics chips. He began by claiming that Intel graphics can't run games. "We're not the only ones saying this. This is Tim Sweeney. One of the most important game developers in the entire world. 'Intel is incapable of running modern games. Intel's integrated graphics just don't work. I don't think they will ever work.' This wasn't said in 1994. This was said on March 10, 2008," Huang said.

"(It's) one of the most important apps. I play games. A lot more people play games today than before. It's a big industry. We happen to think games are important. Game developers are important. Game players are important. Online games, important. Retail games, important. First person shooters, important. Simulation games, important. I'm a perfectly grown adult. I'm not ashamed of them."

Intel also has plans to bring out a graphics engine code-named Larrabee that uses "many cores" to take on high-end engineering and scientific applications. And presumably games too.

When asked to comment, Intel spokesman Dan Snyder said, "Are you surprised? Nvidia's CEO has been very vocal about their feelings for several months now, so I don't think any of this comes as a surprise."

Originally posted at Nanotech: The Circuits Blog
Brooke Crothers is a former editor at large at CNET News.com, and has been an editor for the Asian weekly version of the Wall Street Journal. He writes for the CNET Blog Network, and is not a current employee of CNET. Contact him at mbcrothers@gmail.com. Disclosure.
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Add a Comment (Log in or register) 30 comments (Showing first 20 comments)
Fools at Intel
by Striker77s April 10, 2008 4:20 PM PDT
I think Huang's comments are valid. I hope it is just a bunch of marketing idiots at Intel that don't understand the engineering of GPUs, and not Intel as a whole that thinks discrete graphics cards will go away. I have always built my own computers and I change my GPU at least twice as much as I change my mainboard. I have never ever relied on onboard GPU chips for my video needs. Unless the market dynamics change quite a bit I don't see gamers or power users ever relying on onboard GPUs. Mainboards need to be competetive and not everyone wants to spend the money for a $500 GPU. Consumers want a wide range of choices and price points when it comes to GPUs. When a typical mainboard costs $100 you can't expect consumers to start spending $300 on mainboards that have a fast GPU in it which they can't change or upgrade. I don't see computer component manufacturers offering 5 different versions of each mainboard with different GPU options. It is a great idea for Intel to partner with NVidia and offer better onboard GPUs but to get rid of the discrete GPU line is just plain stupid. I'm sure ATI loves the idea.
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Grow up!
by p.zurek April 10, 2008 4:38 PM PDT
Maybe the guy should grow up and stop playing games and start working. Big companies take on small companies all the time. That's why small companies are looking for big sugar daddies to buy them out.
Reply to this comment View all 2 replies
GPUs will always easily outperforms Itegrated Graphics...
by Francky B April 10, 2008 6:42 PM PDT
At least for the next 5 years or decade. And thats only if intel decides to create there own comparable GPU.

I do computer animation, and NEVER would I even think of not using a GPU card when working with 3D Apps. These application demand the best performance available when dealing with large projects and working with integrated graphics is suicide. It basically feels like working on a old pentium 1 machine. So rest assured, Nvidia will remain king for a long time still.
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huang is scared and you are a moron
by slickuser April 10, 2008 10:24 PM PDT
nvidia is just scared. Stop whining and innovote!
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HUNAG - STOP WHINING INSTEAD ...
by slickuser April 10, 2008 10:27 PM PDT
INNOVATE!
INNOVATE!
INNOVATE!

OR

GIVE UP & QUIT
Reply to this comment
I'm not going back to integrated graphics...
by benjwah April 10, 2008 10:39 PM PDT
Ugh. I remember the first computer I managed to buy for myself. And the first laptop. They both had integrated graphics.
I will never hurt myself that way again. Intel will have to try a LOT harder and do a LOT better in future. And they'll have to do it for a long time before I'll trust them with my graphics again.
Love their CPU's, hate their graphics.
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Oops my graphic chip died... time to replace the CPU and Motherboard again
by umbrae April 11, 2008 6:03 AM PDT
Integrating devices is bad. The only thing I ever use that is integrated is the network interface. Having everything on-board will help people that want cheap PCs that they will replace every year, but this strategy is only to the benefit of the people making the boards as you will buy new ones a lot.

Anyone who plays games or wants to watch HD movies on their PC will not be using an integrated chip. And Intels graphic chips are the worst in the business.
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Intel Needs Out of the Graphics Business
by Mercury23 April 11, 2008 7:06 AM PDT
Intel's graphics are shoddy at best. Extremely low budget and barely capable of anything that remotely resembles performance.

Intel should just give up on graphics and leave it to the big guys at AMD/ATI and Nvidia who know what they are doing.

Onboard graphics are only good on laptops and for old desktops that do nothing more than word processing.
Reply to this comment
Nvidia Can Make its Own Multicore CPU and Kick Intel's Ass
by eightwings April 11, 2008 7:22 AM PDT
Nvidia needs no lesson from Intel. Neither Intel nor AMD can make a proper multicore CPU. They don't know how. They made the fateful decision to go the multithreaded route and they're in a panic right now because multithreaded apps are a pain in the ass to write. Nvidia can leapfrog over the rest of the industry and design its own multicore CPU, one that combines the strengths of both MIMD and SIMD parallelism without their weaknesses. Intel and the others would not know what hit them. To find out why multithreading is not part of the future of parallel computing, Google "Nightmare on Core Street".
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What NVidia needs to do
by nachurboy April 11, 2008 9:13 AM PDT
is integrate the GPU and memory module into the motherboard, rather than as an expansion card. That means integrating a GPU socket and a SO-DIMM slot for the video memory DIMM. Not only would you reduce costs for making the boards and increase profit margins (only need to sell the gpu and makes upgrading easy), but it frees up slots. Just integrate the controller and everything else onto the chipset and create a superfast bus to the GPU and GPU memory.
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Intel graphics saga
by williamUK4CA April 11, 2008 9:43 AM PDT
Having worked for Intel - and having been an Intel watcher for over 25 years - I would say that Intel has never been excellent in graphics - not in 1984; not in 1994; not in 2004; and not now it would seem. Best wishes Nvidia.
Reply to this comment
Too many technical issues for the next decade or so...
by drfrost April 11, 2008 11:26 AM PDT
First of all, this reply assumes you're playing modern games on your PC. If you don't fall under this category then read no further.

A video system requires an ENORMOUS amount of memory bandwidth. But the memory is accessed in a very LINEAR manner. This leads to memory and memory subsystems optimized for these type of accesses. A general CPU does not access memory in as linear a manner. Memory and memory subsystems optimized for a general purpose CPU is going to look different. If you optimize for one, you degrade the performance of the other if you're trying to integrate the two systems.

Furthermore, CPU's have memory bandwidth issues of their own. And this is getting MUCH worse as intel moves to put more cores on a single piece of silicon. Allocating a large chunk of that to video is going to seriously hurt CPU performance... and if you don't you'll seriously hurt video performance.

So even if you integrate the video function onto the the CPU, it's going to need it's own memory managment system and it's own memory interface dedicated to memory optimized for video performance or it's going to perform poorly.

I don't think Intel is going to be able to deal with the package issues and other technical issues that doing this properly is going to raise for some time.
Reply to this comment
Nvidia Don't Need No Stinking x86 Compatibility
by eightwings April 11, 2008 12:41 PM PDT
The x86 CPU is a diseased dinosaur, a putrid piece of garbage from the 20th century. Nvidia must forge a new market, a market worthy of the 21st century. It only has to design a box that is wickedly fast at everything (not just graphics and video games) and easily programmable; a box that also sports a kick-ass internet browser. That alone is enough to do serious damage to the status quo. Nvidia then needs to provide free application development tools and pre-written, downloadable plug-compatible modules that anybody and their uncle Bob and aunt Mary can use to snap together sophisticated applications. Just drag'm and drop'm. A huge online pool of extensible apps will mushroom almost overnight.

All of this can be done because, after 150 years, Nvidia will have reinvented the computer. It's time to say goodbye to Charles Babbage and break the Wintel monopoly. Who needs Windows or x86 compatibility if you can download any app you want and play wickedly cool games on top of it? Is Nvidia up to the challenge? Is anybody?
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Intel Graphics, NVidia SLI Motherboards
by bunkey91405 April 11, 2008 2:55 PM PDT
To NVidia's CEO, if you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen. What do you think Intel feels about the exclusive NVidia video card(s) SLI motherboards? Do we hear "cry baby" public statements from Intel? Push a "600 pound gorilla" and don't be surprised, if it pushes back. So, NVidia grow up and deal with a situation you brought on by your own actions and conduct.
Reply to this comment
by ZohaibKhairi September 13, 2008 11:50 AM PDT
Man, if only Nvidia merged with Intel, AMD would be screwed then amd would have to drop their **** real low, and then consumers would be happy :O 20$ computers that can play crysis
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