February 28, 2008 2:10 PM PST

Microsoft e-mails detail Vista woes

As happens every year or so, some juicy Microsoft e-mails have surfaced as part of litigation that the software maker is party to.

In this case, Microsoft is being sued over a program in 2006 that labeled some PCs as Windows Vista Capable ahead of the operating system's mainstream release in January 2007. As part of the discovery process, a number of e-mails have emerged with Microsoft executives discussing various problems with Vista as it came to market.

In one e-mail, Steven Sinofsky writes to Steve Ballmer that three factors were to blame for early Vista challenges.

First off, he said, "No one really believed we would ever ship so they didn't start the work until very late in 2006." He added that his Brother home printer didn't have drivers until after Vista's commercial launch.

Secondly, he said, major changes to the way Vista handles audio and video caused headaches, particularly for those upgrading from XP. Finally, he said, many Windows XP drivers didn't really work under Vista. "This is across the board for printers, scanners, wan, accessories (fingerprint readers, smartcards, tv tuners), and so on," Sinofsky wrote. "This category is due to the fact that many of the associated applets don't run within the constraints of the security model or the new video/audio driver models."

Sinofsky noted that Microsoft executive Orlando Ayala had stuck with XP because there was no Vista driver for his Verizon mobile wireless card. "The Vista Ready logo program required drivers available on (January 30). I think we had had reasonable coverage, but quality was uneven as I experienced," he wrote.

One of the key issues raised in the e-mail exchange was the fact that by loosening the rules for one of Intel's chip sets, Microsoft was creating a class of machines that were allowed to be marketed as Windows Vista Capable, even though those same machines would not be eligible to even get Vista Basic logo certification once the software was released. I raised this issue in an article back in the spring of 2006.

Sinofsky notes this issue in his e-mail, as do several other executives. "The '915' chipset which is not Aero capable is in a huge number of laptops and was tagged as 'Vista Capable' but not Vista Premium (ready)," he wrote. "I don't know if this was a good call."

The e-mail exchanges also include a note from Mike Ybarra to Jim Allchin saying that "We are caving to Intel." In the same e-mail, he notes that Microsoft was "really burning HP" which had agreed to build its machines with graphics chips that had a Vista-specific driver that could take advantage of the operating system's high-end interface features, unlike the aforementioned Intel 915 chipset.

These e-mails are particularly salient to this court case, in which Microsoft faces a class action suit over the fact that machines labeled as Windows Vista Capable were nonetheless not capable of running many of the operating system's features.

But the e-mails also show clearly that Microsoft executives saw early on that customers were likely to have negative experiences with the operating system, particularly when it came to compatibility with existing hardware. Sinofsky expressed surprise that Microsoft didn't get more complaints to its support lines, but said that he did not take that as a sign of satisfaction.

"I think we have a lot of new PCs, which helps and the hobbyist people who bought (packaged copies of Windows) just know what to do and aren't calling, but I know they are struggling," he said.

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Add a Comment (Log in or register) 51 comments (Page 1 of 2)
finger print reader...
by SeizeCTRL February 28, 2008 2:32 PM PST
I have a Microsoft Fingerprint Reader and it does not work under Vista 64... that alone tells me they have a lot of issues to work out internally. Sure, they have a 32bit Vista drivers, but you can't even trick it into installing on Vista 64.
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Struggling ... ROTFLMAO
by craj2008 February 28, 2008 2:43 PM PST
The problem with the idea of making devices that are going to be ready for the next stage of an operating system upgrade is that the people developing the software for the next generation of devices aren't using the previous generation of devices during development rigorously. They build in futuristic features using futuristic products and almost never check for backwards compatibility. This email scenario doesn't surprise me in the slightest and whatever the fallout from it should be an excellent eye opener for Microsoft. Falling flat on one's face is by far the most useful way to learn. Right? We've all done it our lives. I know I struggled with the upgrade from XP to Vista on an HP DV9005us that was supposed to be ready for Vista Home Premium, but... 1. DVD drivers and programs went haywire. 2. Built-in webcam drivers and programs ground to a screeching halt. 3. Backup and restore functionality was a nightmare afterwards. and the list goes on...
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Even MSFT thinks it's a pig!?
by Penguinisto February 28, 2008 2:58 PM PST
Damn... No, really... Damn! I mean, look at some of these damnign comments... and note that these come from Microsoft execs: [i]"In addition to some of the previously reported excerpts -- including executive Mike Nash's complaint that compatibility problems turned his $2,100 PC into nothing more than an "email machine""[/i] ...a $2100 email machine? I paid that much for my current Mac, and I can tell you for certain that it does a whole lot more than just email... :) [i]"For example, OrlandoA [Microsoft executive Orlando Ayala] is not on Vista because there are no drivers for his Verizon card yet. Microsoft's own hardware was missing a lot of support (fingerprint reader, MCE extender, etc.)"[/i] Heh - now mind you this is post-release... and a senior MSFT exec can't even get onto his own network... [i]"Intel has the biggest challenge. Their "945" chipset which is the baseline Vista set "barely" works right now and is very broadly used. The "915" chipset which is not Aero capable is in a huge number of laptops and was tagged as "Vista Capable" but not Vista Premium. I don't know if this was a good call. But these function but will never be great. Even a 945 set has new builds of drivers coming out constantly but hopes are on the next chipset rather than this one."[/i] So, err... one of the most popular chipsets out there (the 945 series), and Vista sucks mud on it. ...sourced from the Seattle PI ( http://blog.seattlepi.nwsource.com/microsoft/archives/132891.asp ) Meanwhile, we see (speaking of Intel), MSFT flacks blaming hardware, where in reality software should always be written to the hardware, not the other way around. After all, Compiz/XGL does everything Aero does (and more), but it runs just fine on the named chipsets. Hackintosh folks report that OSX can run on it (even though it was never designed to)... so what's MSFT's problem? -- I cannot re-iterate enough how damned happy I am that I have never had the curse of Vista RTM on any machines that I personally own... the betas and RC's were torture enough. /P
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PS:
by Penguinisto February 28, 2008 3:00 PM PST
Where's all the MSFT apologists? Their fevered defenses of something that MSFT can't even admit internally as worth defending should be... interesting. /P
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What was the difference
by Mick Blackledge February 28, 2008 3:24 PM PST
Most XP people I know were already so hammered that they did not notice the difference. They have stopped computing altogether.
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M$ still behaving like idiots
by nyurbiz February 28, 2008 3:32 PM PST
They will never learn. Wait for the effing products to be right before releasing them.
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Windows 7 is just around the corner.
by ServedUp February 28, 2008 3:48 PM PST
Whatever Microsoft didn't do in Vista or had intended to do. Will basically show up in Windows 7. For one its a lucky number and two all the kinks will be ironed out for this OS and it will probably beat the pants off OS X - The King of OSes, to date. Longhorn 1 was a test. Longhorn 2 all the way baby!!
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Vista woes - response- they should have known
by gmshin February 28, 2008 4:17 PM PST
I have been a faithful Microsoft customer for a very long time. I liked the way the product was compatible with most PC hardware and software that I could buy anywhere in the world - that was inexpensive and relatively easy to use. But Microsoft has really hurt themselves (or should have if they weren't so large) with this product line (Vista) in my opinion. There is no reason a product with so many defects should have been released. I have a Dell Core 2 Duo that came with Vista on it. Practically nothing that I buy has drivers that will make them work without a lot of trouble. In some cases, I simply give up and use my old XP machine. They are worse than Apple in making things so proprietary. Secondly, I consistently have failures out of the blue even when not using any new device or software. Statements telling me that something has caused Windows to shut down, when nearly every time the something is a Microsoft product. Print spooler errors even when no printer is installed, errors that suddenly appear after a Windows autoupdate that were not there before. Blue screens of death several times a week. By the way, I can't see how this could be a hardware issue since I have friends with the exact same model who have back-graded to XP SP2 and are loving the machine now (Dell D620). Also, I work on computers of many kinds every day from users. None of them that has Vista works correctly to do all that I would need it for. Almost all are totally dissatisfied. Think about this Microsoft. You may have made Vista to capture some of the MAC market, but you are losing customers to the MAC faster because of Vista! I'm sorry to be so negative but it is a broken resource hog.
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Vista is a dog
by t8 February 28, 2008 4:20 PM PST
I had a friend who bought a new laptop and it had Vista and what a dog. It was really slow and is buggered up Skype. After downloading the latest Skype and doing this and that, we decided to put XP on instead, and what a difference. Conclusion. Vista is a dog. I heard lots of bad things about it, but until this experience, I believe the stories now.
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vista home premium
by annroi February 28, 2008 5:15 PM PST
I'm no computer expert but Vista is a BUST. The finger print I D does not work on my new HPNOTEPAD HP support appears to know of the many problems but is vague in commenting suggest I call Microsoft for ($100) solution. This system is a ripoff and I want my XP back, fortunately I havw my old desktop.
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  • About Beyond Binary

  • During her seven years at CNET News.com, Ina Fried has changed beats several times, changed genders once and covered both of the Pirates of Silicon Valley. These days most of her attention is focused on Microsoft.


    Beyond Binary is a look at how technology is changing our lives and the people behind all that life-changing stuff, with an extra emphasis on that which emanates from Redmond, Wash.

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