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Jon Johansen, the 20-something hacker widely known for helping crack the piracy protections on DVDs several years ago, is taking on Apple Computer again. He has reverse-engineered Apple's FairPlay, the digital rights management technology used to make iPod and iTunes a closed system.
As reported earlier, the Norwegian has started DoubleTwist Ventures to license his work. The technology will make other online music stores work with Apple's iPod device and let iTunes songs play on gadgets other than the iPod, said Monique Farantzos, Johansen's business associate and DoubleTwist co-founder.
Farantzos said she made contact with Johansen after reading a profile of him in The Wall Street Journal. The pair sees a business in making digital media interoperable. They started working on this in the spring and are now talking publicly about it. The first customer has signed on, though its name is not being disclosed.
If successful, DoubleTwist could break through the wall Apple has built around its music business. Farantzos, a biophysicist by training but now into technology business development, talked about the company's plans and challenges with CNET News.com. (Farantzos photo courtesy of J.D. Lasica.)
Q: What is it the company doing?
Farantzos: We have two components in the business. One is to enable other online stores to wrap their content with FairPlay so that it works on the iPod. Major labels and studios do not release their content unprotected. If you want to offer DRM protected content and you want it to play on the iPod, you have to use FairPlay. So we have developed a method for making content compatible with the iPod.
We also plan to allow competing devices play iTunes content. When you buy a DVD, you know that the DVD will play on your Toshiba or Sony or Philips player, but when you buy music or video online, you don't have that. It is kind of like the zoo: Every animal is singing a different tune. We hope to make sense of that, and we have developed a technology to enable that.
And this is technology developed by Jon.
Farantzos: It is based on Jon's work.
And this technology isn't something that Apple can easily shut the door on, as they've done in the past with RealNetworks' Harmony? Will we see update after update to keep it working?
We have our own way to make sure it works and keeps on working. An important element is that the user will not need to do anything on their part. We have technology that basically guarantees that it works for them. User-friendliness--we thought that through extensively.
What if Apple finds out how this works and updates its technology to block your hack? Or do you not think this can happen?
It is not as easy as it sounds. They have sold 1.5 billion songs and there has to be some level of backward compatibility, otherwise it is going to be very painful for their users. We are confident that what we have works and will keep on working.
Can you give me an example of how your technology works? Say I'm a maker of media players, and I would like my device to be able to play iTunes content?
You would license some code that you would embed in your device and then there would be an application that would be installed on the computer that the device is syncing with. Essentially, what we do is trick iTunes into thinking that the device is an iPod.
Is your technology ready to be licensed and used, or is it still in development?
Some parts of it are ready, and there are still things we're improving upon. Online stores offering content for the iPod--that is going to come first. What they would do is just add another button on their site that says: "Click here to download this to your iPod." Sure, the iPod supports MP3s, but that is kind of a moot point because I cannot buy a major band in MP3 format, almost nobody offers unprotected content.
Being able to play iTunes songs on other media players, that needs more time to develop. Any idea when that might be done?
Yes, we're still working on that. I can't give a timeframe.
Next year sometime, or even before the end of the year?
Well, we joke that Steve Jobs will not send us a Christmas card this year. I am sure some people at Apple are upset about losing their monopoly.
Do you think you can get away with this?
We have consulted extensively with attorneys. Wrapping content with FairPlay is definitely within the limits of the law. We're not removing any copy protection, we're simply adding copy protection.
Over the next few months, on the hardware side, you're going to see interoperability become more and more of an issue, and there may even be some antitrust concerns that come up. I think we're in pretty good shape.
Are you betting that antitrust concerns will come up and that you will be the first to offer the remedy?
We're kind of in the first wave, yes. The current situation is unsustainable. Now Microsoft is coming out with their own closed system, and I even read something about Real coming with their own closed system with another manufacturer.
It is the law of the jungle out there. Things have to start working. The devices and music have to start working with each other; otherwise, consumers will probably end up buying pirated or unprotected content to solve their problem if we don't solve it for them.
You haven't heard anything from Apple yet?
What would they say? It would be premature for Apple to do anything anyway. We have not heard from Apple at all. (Apple declined to comment.)
Your company is DoubleTwist Ventures. Is it backed by any venture investors?
There are some individuals supporting it. We've been in a unique situation as a start-up, because we've been profitable since Day One. We have encountered overwhelming interest for our products.
See more CNET content tagged:
Apple Computer,
Apple iTunes,
Apple iPod,
online store,
DVD
1. It probably won't affect ipod sales at all. If anything it will probably strengthen them.
2. It might hurt itunes, but Apple doesn't make money on itunes and as Cnet reported... most the majority of ipod owners download very little from iTunes.
downloading this music...who is?
2. From Apple "You agree that you will not attempt to, or
encourage or assist any other person to, circumvent or modify
any security technology or software that is part of the Service or
used to administer the Usage Rules."
Modify is a broad term.
iTunes."
Then who bought the 1.5 BILLION songs? Zune owners? Talk about
a disconnect from reality. Sheeeshhh...
How the court will rule will likely not be as important as how long it will take to resolve the issue.
What company would risk setting up a business model based on Jon's software when it is very likely that Apple could get a restraining order to halt its use, then spend as much time and money as necessary to win the case? Or, if it drags on for a long time, starve out anyone who licensed Jon's software.
Bottom line. I don't see this ever becoming a viable commercial product.
http://news.com.com/Apple+fights+RealNetworks+hacker+tactics/2100-1027_3-5490604.html
http://news.com.com/RealNetworks+breaks+Apple's+hold+on+iPod/2100-1027_3-5282063.html
can wrap Apple's proprietary FairPlay DRM around files without
needing to pay Apple royalties. This isn't just about the DMCA's
provisions that prevent tampering with copy protection. If Apple
continues to choose to not license FairPlay, that's its call and
other music stores can't legally use it. And unless my
understanding of the DMCA is wrong, it also has provisions to
prevent reverse-engineering copy-protection, so DoubleTwist
can't just create a FairPlay "clone".
As for tricking MP3 players into responding as iPods ... it sounds
like they're banking on making MP3 players pretending to be old
iPods (which Apple can't really abandon easily). That's pretty
clever. But, it too, could be a perilous activity. MP3 player
manufacturers would have to knowingly embed Apple ID info
(which I suspect is trademarked, copyrighted and/or patented).
Again, seems like an easy case for Apple to win ... and not
anything a reputable manufacturer would dare do.
Putting on my Devil's Advocate hat ... I don't see a ton of
downside for Apple if other music stores could sell songs for
playback on iPods. True, it diminishes iTunes' dominance, but it
would help sell more iPods.
Of course, if Apple were to license FairPlay so others' players
could decode it, Apple could stand to make a good bundle of
cash on licensing fees. And it would further cement Apple in the
digital entertainment industry with FairPlay as THE DRM
standard. But we all know MS would never license it, so that'll
never happen.
Still, this is an interesting plot twist. It'll be fun to watch what
happens.
I have never used an IPOD or Apple Music Store does anyone know if they say you cannot use on anything else?
I mean you can legally download the music and play on your computer right? And put ripped cds on ipods?
Is there really a difference?
Plus Apple will sue DoubleTwist... who knows if they will win... But, Apple has a bigger legal budget than DoubleTwist.
Apple could sue DoubleTwist but the DMCA has a provision about reverse-engineering and interoperablity. Apple would be fighting an uphill battle seeing that this could benifit them.
I wish you luck
The question is balance and marketplace dynamic. If people aren't satisfied with iTunes and their offerings, go elsewhere. Rip all your CDs and purchase your music from someone else. But iTunes should be allowed to develop the product with the protections they see fit.
No one forced you to buy their product - and they ain't the only player in town.
What moron would want their device syncing to the iTunes store where Apple effectively promotes iPods time and time again?
iTunes (or anybody else for that matter) insists on controlling
what I do with the music I buy online I will NEVER purchase
music online. I feel that I bought the music for my own
"personal" use and if I want to load it on every device in my
home that's my right to do so. I'm not a pirate, I'm not sharing
the music with anyone, I just want to load in on my computer to
listen to it there or on my iPod to take the music on the go or
burn it to a cd so i can play it in my car. If the music industry
wants to take that right away from me then I'm more than happy
to keep my money..
and they wonder why music sales are down, it's their own fault.
1)Apple will let this fiasco take place
2)The technology involved in deleting (i no it's not what DoubleTwist Venture say but it's basically what they are doing) the DRM will work on the long term (how can they predict Apple's moves? and knowing the bright army of computer engineers in Cupertino they will eventually find a way...)
This just reminds me of the FairUse4WMV affair...any news now lol? This company and "DVDJon" are just a bunch of glory hunters desperate for their 5minutes of fame. If you're so bright why can't you do something legal and productive?
To sum up, i no it's great news for us, but no way is it legal and efficient on the long term.
The legal issue is a bit harder, unless DVDJon happens to be as talented in law as he is in programming. But as some have pointed out, the whole world isn't the US and much of it has little to no appreciation for the wishes of Hollywood and their DRM wet dreams.
I for one applaud his efforts. Even if they fail, they are a step in the right direction and furthering the dialog. Anyone who remains opposed to open standards in content deliver just isn't thinking with a clear head. Companies have been getting away with it now, but as soon as another company has a product that is cooler than the iPod (yes, it will happen), there will be millions of pissed off consumers who are shocked and outraged that they have to re-purchase their music collections or forgo the object of their gearlust.
Don't forget that just because Apple's lawyers may decide to bring a suit that does not guarantee a favorable result. You do recall Apple vs Microsoft back in the early 90's?
An important factor to keep in mind is that these efforts are aimed at facilitating a consumer's ability to use media that has been purchased. It is the sort of thing that various EU countries have started to argue for with veiled threats of antitrust action against Apple. This service could possibly shield Apple from such legal threats whereas trying to shut it down could lead to very unfavorable legislation in France and other large markets.
Prison? I think not! haha
upload content to the iPod via iTunes.
This means that Apple can change their DRM at any given moment
in time: the change iTunes, and the next time you connect your
iPod to the computer, the firmware of the iPod gets transparently
updated as well, making this again a working combination. The
new iTunes will convert your music library in the background to the
new DRM, and you even won't have noticed.
Buy CDs or use Limewire, depending on your ethics.:-)
ethically challenged file "sharers".
about how I shop.
Now as for the other stores (selling WMA based product), I agree.
WMA hurts my ears and I strongly suggest people avoid it.
Oh, wait a minute .......
Oh, wait a minute .......
These companies that continue to make proprietary products are doomed to fail!
Make a product for everyone, it will sell like hotcakes!!!
Having owned "3" iPods (3rd Gen 10GB, 1GB Shuffle, 40GB Photo) and purchased almost 400+ songs from iTMS, I can say that Apple has really made an easy to use portable music solution. However, with each purchase, I know I'm locking myself more and more into the iPod. iPod is great, awesome, cool, etc., but if I got a Zune or Zen Vision W, I cannot play iTMS purchases on it, or AAC without conversion.
There are many other types of players (some better than iPod, and cheaper!) that people are starting to become more aware of and want to use with their AAC and iTMS purchases.
I sincerely applaud anyone or any organization that works to make things "open" so that the consumer has choice over what devices and services he/she wishes to patron. In other words, it should be (and has always been historically) the consumer that dictates the market trend, not the manufacturer.
Apple will eventually open the iPod or iTMS to other players and services, but not while their market share is above 70%. You can rest assured that if iPod/iTMS fell into the 40% range, you'll see WMA Protected files on iPods and iTMS purchases on Nomad, Zune, and others.
Having owned "3" iPods (3rd Gen 10GB, 1GB Shuffle, 40GB Photo) and purchased almost 400+ songs from iTMS, I can say that Apple has really made an easy to use portable music solution. However, with each purchase, I know I'm locking myself more and more into the iPod. iPod is great, awesome, cool, etc., but if I got a Zune or Zen Vision W, I cannot play iTMS purchases on it, or AAC without conversion.
There are many other types of players (some better than iPod, and cheaper!) that people are starting to become more aware of and want to use with their AAC and iTMS purchases.
I sincerely applaud anyone or any organization that works to make things "open" so that the consumer has choice over what devices and services he/she wishes to patron. In other words, it should be (and has always been historically) the consumer that dictates the market trend, not the manufacturer.
Apple will eventually open the iPod or iTMS to other players and services, but not while their market share is above 70%. You can rest assured that if iPod/iTMS fell into the 40% range, you'll see WMA Protected files on iPods and iTMS purchases on Nomad, Zune, and others.
As long as electronics and machine code are made in China & Asia
Cracking or tricking the code is easy as long as each reach the same
State in each player or electronic machine.
Electronics the part of hardware in all these units follow same rules to reach each state
All DRM?S do is stop this state from being reached.
music store on the planet.
How do they compete? Simple, they use a method of DRM that suits
their needs, and one that every other company on the planet has to
compete against (if they wish to compete with Apple, that is).
What DVDJon does, is to make competition impossible. Keep this
up, and you'll see stores close, vendors pull out of the market, and
leave one company in complete control.
Once that happens, sit and watch as the prices skyrocket.
- this may actually get me to buy a Zune
-
by ddhboy
November 24, 2006 7:29 AM PST
- I'm like many others. I used the Itunes music store. Through the constant pro-ipod ads, I got an Ipod. Then I realized that after my Ipod broke, I didn't like them. But hey, what can I do. I'm stuck with a brand I don't want to use because I like the Itunes music store. If they can get this to work legally as well as keep it safe from Apple updating. I was hoping that the EU would call this as a monopoly, but that hope seems to be dwindling. Still I would love to be able to use other MP3 players and still use Itunes. I'll keep an eye out for this.
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