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I personally installed CFLs in all the fixtures and lamps in my home that have shades or glass coverings. And I really haven't been able to tell the difference. But when I tried the CFLs for recessed lighting in my kitchen, they took about 30 seconds to come on and the light was extremely harsh. It was so bothersome we had to put the old ones back in. What do you say to this type of a complaint?
Levine: You probably bought the wrong ones. If you buy a bad bulb, don't equate all CFL bulbs with that.
I will tell you personally, I used to get headaches from compact fluorescents. I actually now have one as my bedside light that I read by before I go to sleep at night.
And you're saying it's because you had a different kind?
Levine: Yeah, it's a newer bulb, newer technology.
So, people who want to make the change, what should they look for on the packaging to make sure they buy the "good" CFLs as opposed to the harsh-looking ones?
Levine: Look for major manufacture labels: Philips, Sylvania, GE; there's a couple others. The ones you buy at the 99 cents store, while cheap, aren't good. Look for the Energy Star label. If you've got lights that go in dimmer switches--this is one difference between the two--compact fluorescents that are used with dimmer switches actually have to say dimmable on them. You can go find them in a lot of stores: Home Depot, Lowe's, you know, Ikea, Target. I was more successful there than I have been in grocery stores, I will tell you that.
This is just sort of a kitchen table question, but what about the fact that CFLs are more expensive initially?
Levine: Marginally.
In my own research, I found the average 75-watt incandescent bulb was about 82 cents, and a 20-watt CFL, the equivalent to the 75 watt, is about $4.80. That's not a big deal for you and me, but how would poor families offset the initial higher cost?
Levine: The average cost we found here is $3 versus 50 cents for comparable bulbs. That doesn't take into account that, at least in California, most of the energy companies--whether they're the investor-owned utilities or municipal utilities--engage in giveaway programs.
In my district...the department of water and power brought 1,000 lightbulbs to give away all free. The Sacramento Municipal Utility District has a program where they subsidize them at hardware stores so you can get them for about 99 cents, or two for 99 cents.
We've done things here in California that actually provide incentives to the utility companies to give away lightbulbs. We have put energy efficiency at the top of our energy loading order...so it's the first thing that they're required to invest in.
Secondly, we have broken the linkage between the profit and the energy sold. In the old model, the more energy you sold, the more money you got. We don't actually do that.
How does that work?
Levine: A very complicated formula through the Public Utilities Commission basically smooths out an average rate of return for the energy companies...If this year you sell less in California because you've engaged in energy efficiency, we still smooth out your average to make sure that your profits aren't dipping.
OK.
Levine: So because of those two incentives a lot of the companies treat energy efficiency as procurement, not just as a public benefit. And one of the things they do is give away or subsidize the sale of lightbulbs.
CFLs can't be thrown out with regular thrash. Are there measures in the final version of your bill to provide for this?
Levine: Yes, we will be engaged in an educational effort with consumers, and the recycling component would be there as well.
Is there anything else you wanted to add?
Levine: You know, as a kind of half-joke, I say everybody wants the electricity but nobody wants the power plants, and everybody wants electricity but nobody wants the power line. Well, then we need to use our energy more efficiently, and this just follows in that vein.
If you can't bring yourself right now to make the switch for every light, what about your porch light? Does your porch light really have to be incandescent? You know, what about your outside lights? What about your garage lights? What about closet lights? Look around your house. How many bulbs are there that you could change that you don't read by?
Those are the kinds of changes people can start to make even if they're not going to go 100 percent. You can still make a savings, make an energy savings, make a cost savings.
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1. There is about a one second delay at power on, and
2. It does take 20-30 seconds for them to reach full brightness.
Other than that, we enjoy them. Not to mention my light bill is noticeably lower.
They contain Mercury, which everybody knows is a posion. Are we
going to start filling the landfills with this deadly substance now?
Many places that CFL's fall short, LED's can pick up the slack. CFL's don't take well to vibration or impact, they really can't be focused into a spot light, and many don't like the quality of the light. LED's are more durable than incandescents, and focus pretty well. LED's are available in every color, and a broad array of color temperatures for white. The newest generation of LED's are just as efficient as fluorescents as well (80-100 lm/W.)
Hopefully there will be a bit of a paradigm shift in the lighting industry. The traditional edison light socket is not ideal for LED or fluorescent lighting (look how long it's taken the industry to make good fluorescent's that fit it.) LED's have only recently reached the power density (15W white LED's are now out in the wild. About as bright as a 40-60 watt bulb,) and efficiency to be a serious option for fixed lighting.
I have yet to find a CFL that fits in a standard lamp that outputs 3900 lumens. It would be about 50 watts or so.
My experience with CFL bulbs is that they do not last any longer than a standard incandescent bulb, about 3 months.
The only issue I've noticed with CFL's is that they tend to take a little time to warm up to achieve maximum brightness.
They are starting to make "oversized" CFL's to give more total light output than Standard 100W Bulbs.
Early CFL's were not as bright per watt. Now they are brighter and every bit the match for the equivilent regualar bulb.
Alas since I think in watts and not Lumens (beyond flashlights) I can't reccomend a bulb to hit your lumen rating. Only that if it's a standard bulb's output you should be able to find something that works in a CFL.
would not introduce toxic levels of a dangerous poison into the eco-system are likely to be staggering. A case in point
.http://www.canada.com/nationalpost/financialpost/story.html?id=aa7796aa-e4a5-4c06-be84-b62dee548fda
Coal mines are currently being hassled for their mercury emissions.
Other than medical reports that say high mercury levels can make you really really stupid, I have not yet seen the CFL-mercury issue recognized, let alone an unbiased analysis.
I'm normally skeptical when people start spewing free market rhetoric but perhaps this would work better through the market than banning a specific technology.
However, unfortunately the last few years have shown consumers really don't always make the best decisions. Too many people are apathetic and don't care.The sales of SUVs are high even when it makes no sense. If it just affected the individual it would be different but global warming and peak oil affect everyone. And I doubt the ACLU will be up in arms about someone's "right" to obsolete lightbulbs being infringed by forcing them to buy ones that'll save them money anyway.
It isn't just about consumers either, things like this are just as much to force manufacturers to make a change as well.
We have used flourescent lights in schools, office buildings, stores, industry and just about every purpose other than residential lighting for decades. They haven't resulted in an environmental nightmare. The new standards have reduced mercury content of CFLs to an extremely small amount. If you crack them open, wear gloves and sweep it into a sealed bag. Throw in trash.
The current issue of Popular Mechanics tested various brands of CFLs against an incandescent standard. The CFLs were judged to have superior light quality than the incandescent, and the difference in the amount of light produced between both types was indistinguishable.
When Solid state lighting (LEDs) becomes economical, CFLs will no doubt meet their demise. If this is 10 - 20 years from now, you'd only have to replace the CFLs a handful of times in that time period. Even if they burn out prematurely, the branded CFLs have a 5 year warranty. You'd only have to "buy" 4 bulbs per socket over the course of 20 years.
should be used. However, every house has a few lamps which
receive little use, such as in closets. In closets, it would be silly
to use CFLs since closet lights are used for only a few minutes a
day. Also, when CFLs are switched on and off often, their life is
considerably reduced and under those conditions, they might
not last as long as incandescent bulbs.
Also, what about light bulbs used in ovens and clothes dryers?
The heat would destroy CFLs.
Although I believe that people should be encouraged to use
CFLs, there are places where they make no sense and therefore
incandescent bulbs should remain available.
CFL bulbs are recommended to be used where they will be on for a minimum of 3 hours at a time, or once a day. CFLs are excellent for general room lighting, where it comes on at dusk and off at bed time. They are also excellent for reading, again it gets turned on and stays on till you're done for the day.
Bathrooms do NOT need fixtures with 6 or 8 light sockets. Especially when theres one of these fixtures over each sink. Home builders should be limited to installing fixtures with AT MOST 4 lights, with two being preferred.
Each of the light fixtures should have it's own switch, you don't always need both sinks at once.
To conserve power on your own:
Replace the existing 100 watt bulbs with 40 watt bulbs. 4x40 watts, is 160 watts, that's plenty of light in a bathroom.
Replace multi-light fixtures with ones using fewer lights. Instead of 6 or 8 bulbs, a fixture using 2 bulbs is fine. Having only 2 bulbs to replace is less expensive than having 8 to replace.
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by scrutch
July 27, 2008 2:47 PM PDT
- First off, like I predicted years ago, ethynol ain't it. Does nothing but drive up corn prices, which drives up all other crop prices, which drives up all prices, and only compounds the problem. Electricity is the answer, but from where? Wind is good, but the initial expense is herendous, and water is more powerful. Here we go, paddle wheel generators all up and down the Mississippi river, Missouri river, Ohio river, so on and so forth. If that's not enough, catch the tides and prevailing currents off shore. Nothing but a boat dock, paddle wheel, and a generator. Next comes electric cars. But government regs make them all use a uniform standard battery. No need to recharge, just pull into the "usta be a gas station" and swap batteries. No more need for coal burning, carbon footprints, and the Middle East. Tom
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